In this episode, we bring you a recording of a conversation hosted by De Dépendance with historian Quinn Slobodian and writer and technologist Ben Tarnoff, co-authors of the new book Muskism: A Guide for the Perplexed.

Quinn Slobodian is Professor of International History at Boston University and the author of Crack-Up Capitalism, Hayek’s Bastards, and Globalists. Ben Tarnoff is the author of Internet for the People and co-author of Voices from the Valley, and writes extensively on technology, power, and digital politics.

In conversation with journalist Nuria Ribas Costa, they explore the idea of “Muskism”: a political and economic logic embodied by Elon Musk but extending far beyond any single individual. Rather than treating Musk as an exceptional figure, they examine him as a symptom of a broader postliberal age, one in which technological sovereignty, private power, and visions of engineered futures increasingly shape public life.

Together, they discuss the relationship between technology and state power, the appeal of techno-libertarianism, and the ways digital platforms, AI, and infrastructure are reshaping politics and society. Drawing on history, political economy, and contemporary tech culture, Slobodian and Tarnoff ask what Muskism reveals about our present moment—and the kind of future it seeks to build.